| Author | Message | |||
     Jeff Roy New member Username: Jeffr Post Number: 96 Registered: 03-2001 Rating: N/A |
Just want to post an update on this problem in case anyone else runs into it. I did several things to remedy this problem during the off season and so far have not had a single problem with the split rings peeling off. Because I did them all at once it is hard to dertermine what helped and what did not. I think most of the problems stemmed from the winches not being in a fair position and mounted correctly with the absences of the turning blocks at the aft end of the track. The winches needed to be rotated 180 degrees so the drive gear was on the side the sheet loads up on. I raised the winches on 1: winch pads to make sure the sheet was loading on the bottom of the drum. I also used the original fairlead blocks (I added adjustable ones this season) near the end of the coach roof to hold the sheet down, particularly when using the #3. This has virtually eliminated over ride problems. Another issue was that my winches were pretty sloppy. I rebuilt them and found that most of the slop was in the main spindle because the cowlets that slide in and keep the spindle in place were heavily worn. Exact replacements are no longer available so I had to modify ones for the more modern winches with a dremel tool to make them fit. Now the winches have ver little slop. I think the tourque from the sheet load pushing the drum away from the drive gear (due to mountus incorrectus) caused excesive wear. As the wear got worse the rocking of the drum as the sheet loads change made the split rings peel off. Finally, I very carefully ran a file through the groves the split rings sit in removing any potential burrs that could cause them to peel off. Well knock on wood. After a whole season the problem seems to be solved. | |||
| Jeff Roy New member Username: Jeffr Post Number: 86 Registered: 03-2001 Rating: N/A |
Of course I have completely torn them apart, cleaned them very well, rebuilt them..... everything. The guys at Florida Rigging and I have talked about this a lot. In fact Pete and I talked about this just a few months ago and he has assured me the root of all the problems is ... and I quote... "mountus-incorrectus". Pete thinks the removal of the turning blocks results in a poor lead to the winch. He strongly suggests rotating the winches 180 degrees so the drive gear touches the drum exactly where the jib sheet loads on and to raise them up a few inches. An alternative to raising them could be to use an extra fairlead car near the winch to keep the sheet coming into it low. If you start the project on the headliner, contact me with any questions. I have hundreds of photos of the project too. | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 22 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Well that didn't work...this message board says you can add a hyperlink...well cut and paste this to your nav bar. http://www.lewmar.com/webspares/pdf/winch/43_std_winch_part.pdf | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 21 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Damn I hate it when I do that.. Here is a link to a spec sheet with a part number | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 20 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Here is the part I used. It is #2 in the diagram. My boat actually has Lewmar 46's, and this is the diagram for the 43's. If I recall correctly, they are built with mostly the same parts. The 46 has no support online from Lewmar. I think I called Florida Hydraulic Rigging and Controls. The guy at FHRC said that a lot of winches get rebuilt without this plastic piece, primarily because of ultraviolet deterioration of the plastic over time, and eventually it wastes away. I haven't had a chance to measure mine yet, but this was obviously the answer for me as my winches didn't have the plastic washer. As far as them not turning easily, (I hate to suggest this to someone who is obviously very mx savvy and isn't afraid to tear his boat apart), but when was the last time you tore the whole thing apart and cleaned out the old grease? Like landing an airplane, when you get in a slump, get back to the fundamentals. Jeff, you are my hero....I am about ready to tear out the headliner to my boat and replace some balsa and fair and paint as you did in your head. I had been considering it for some time, and you put me over the edge....great minds you know. | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 19 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Here is the part I used. It is #2 in the diagram. My boat actually has Lewmar 46's, and this is the diagram for the 43's. If I recall correctly, they are built with mostly the same parts. The 46 has no support online from Lewmar. I think I called Florida Hydraulic Rigging and Controls. The guy at FHRC said that a lot of winches get rebuilt without this plastic piece, primarily because of ultraviolet deterioration of the plastic over time, and eventually it wastes away. I haven't had a chance to measure mine yet, but this was obviously the answer for me as my winches didn't have the plastic washer. As far as them not turning easily, (I hate to suggest this to someone who is obviously very mx savvy and isn't afraid to tear his boat apart), but when was the last time you tore the whole thing apart and cleaned out the old grease? Like landing an airplane, when you get in a slump, get back to the fundamentals. Jeff, you are my hero....I am about ready to tear out the headliner to my boat and replace some balsa and fair and paint as you did in your head. I had been considering it for some time, and you put me over the edge....great minds you know. | |||
| Jeff Roy New member Username: Jeffr Post Number: 84 Registered: 03-2001 Rating: N/A |
how thick were those washers? The ones they sent me are thick, maybe 3/32"??? I can get them in there but the winch becomes tight and does not spin feely. BTW, Pete from Florida Rigging is convinced that it has a lot to do with the removal of the jib turning blocks. The winch needs to be raised up and rotated so the drive gear is where the line comes on the drum. Since the sheet used to come from aft the gears are on the opposite side. I am going to try this, and look for thinner plastic washers at places like Mcmaster Carr I went through about 12 this year | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 17 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Well Ladies and Gents, I have used the plastic washer under the circlips for over a year of racing and have not wound a circlip off yet. Any questions, just email me. | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 9 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
OK guys...here is the scoop. I called the Lewmar guy and he said that my winches most likely never had the plastic washer under the circlip. He said that most likely there was a burr that was causing the circlip to grind off. Inspected the winch...found a tiny burr, cleaned it off and promptly went thru about 3 more clips in one race. So I figured what the heck and ordered the plastic bushing used in the new winches....you know what? They fit like a glove and I used the heck out of the winch yesterday and it worked like sixty. Jeff -- I thought the washer wouldn't fit, just like yours didn't, but I lifted the spool just a little by putting my finger in the winch handle hole and pulled up. I got enough room to put the washer in. You might want to try it some time. THIS IS DEFINITELY the way to go | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 6 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Thanks...believe it or not, I have 46's and this is happening. I called the parts rep that Lewmar has listed on their website in Fl...Hydraulic and Rigging...guy was super nice and said that these winches were old enough not to be listed on the website and doubted if the original winches had the plastic bushing under the circlip.......I may fab my own and let you know what happens. Shep Shirley "lightning rod" | |||
| Jeff Roy New member Username: Jeffr Post Number: 62 Registered: 03-2001 Rating: N/A |
The Lewmar part # for the plastic washers is 15000684. When I called them last year there was doubt as to whether any of these parts were still available. After a few days they called back and said they located a few and would send them to me. However I was not able to get them to fit and ended up using half of a circlip. At the time I was going through circlips at an amazing rate so I ordered 20 of them. Since I stuck the half clip under the retaining oneI have only had one peel off in a season and a half. It is a little tricky to get the half clip under the full one. I found it easiest to put the full one on and then work the half one under it instead of trying to do it in the other order. The half clip does not fit in the grove on the spindle. I did rebuild my winches since then and found the collets that hold the spindle in place to be worn and I think that is the source of the excess play that seems to cause the problems with the retaining clips. Unfortunately, these collets, part # 15001430, are not in the spare kits they sell now. I plan to order some from them to install during the off season. I will try to attach the PDF schematic of the winches I found on the Lewmar site to this post. If that does not work it is pretty straight forward to find it on their site.
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| John Stefancik New member Username: Jstef Post Number: 18 Registered: 01-2001 Rating: N/A |
Shep, I just lost several this past month, so I have the part numbers handy (I have the older 42s, but I think they are almost identical to the 43s if that's what you have). The retaining rings are called Circlips and are no. B2075. I have no knowledge in my 42 diagram of a small plastic washer underneath the clips. However, this is a spacer that fits around "centre stem" that keeps the "key" from slipping out and making the drum slip up and pressure the spiral clip. The Spacer is no. 15042012. The spiral clips are standard in both of Lewmar's repair kits. Good Luck. John Stefancik Hurricane Kelley Annapolis MD | |||
| William Shirley New member Username: William_shirley Post Number: 5 Registered: 04-2002 Rating: N/A |
Geez this site is terrific....The last two races has seen me strip the retaining ring off the starboard primary (Lewmar)...replaced with new each time...I thought I remembered something about this here. and Viola....Ed...any chance you can get me a part number? Does the Standard Lewmar rebuild kit have the rings and the plastic bushing you all are talking about? Please email me direct if you have better info. Thanks, Shep Shirley Lightning Rod | |||
| JeffR Rating: N/A |
Thanks for the feedback. I got to talk to several people at Lewmar about this problem and they sent me the breakdown diagrams for these winches. As indicated in the diagram there was supposed to be a small plastic washer under the spiral clips. They said many of these disappear when people rebuild their winches and can't figure out where they go or can't get them in place. They sent me several of these and I could not get them to fit, they were too thick. I ended up cutting a spiral ring in half and used the two halves in place of the washers. It got me through the season without anouther problem. I plan on completely stripping down and rebuilding the winches this winter and hope that when everything is clean and the worn parts are replaced I can fit the plastic washers in there. | |||
| goldenomen Rating: N/A |
On goldenomen we had the same problem until i replaced the spiral rings with ss snap rings. i took one to a local marine hardware in key west and he had them in the proper size. hope this helps, ed | |||
| Joe Heslin (Jheslin) Rating: N/A |
I raced my 9.1 for 12 years and the only time I had this problem was when a young "stallion" tried to undo a bad wrap on the winch by yanking straight up. Once it even pulled the entire housing in to the cockpit. | |||
| jeffr Rating: N/A |
OK, this one is straight out of Bizarro World. I have the original Lewmar 43 primary winches on my boat. I have had a real problem with the spiral retaining rings peeling themselves off of them. I have had to replace 10 of them this season! I have talked to a bunch of people and no one has heard of anyone having this kind of problem before. Has anyone else had this happen to them? Any ideas? |
Lewmar 43 schematic
